1177 BC

[Lance]

It's holiday time and I have been reading some books for pure interest. 1177 BC,

http://www.amazon.co.uk/1177-B-C-Civilization-Collapsed-Turning/dp/0691140898/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1420053139&sr=1-1&keywords=1177+bc

is about a historical transition which I knew nothing about. It seems that the first dark ages began then as all the major civilisations in the middle east collapsed and vanished (in many cases we do not even know the names of these vanished peoples and cities and countries). The book draws some interesting parallels with modern times, including globalised trade and climate change as well as war, and refugees...

Recommended.

Lance

[M Winther]

Post by Lance
It's holiday time and I have been reading some books for pure interest. 1177 BC,
http://www.amazon.co.uk/1177-B-C-Civilization-Collapsed-Turning/dp/0691140898/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1420053139&sr=1-1&keywords=1177+bc
is about a historical transition which I knew nothing about. It seems
that the first dark ages began then as all the major civilisations in
the middle east collapsed and vanished (in many cases we do not even
know the names of these vanished peoples and cities and countries). The
book draws some interesting parallels with modern times, including
globalised trade and climate change as well as war, and refugees...
Recommended.
Lance

Who were the "sea people" who crushed these Bronze Age civilizations?
Does the book say?

Mats

[Lance]

Well they were not Vikings!

The book is careful and assesses all claims against the available evidence. I haven't finished but it seems they came from Southern Italy, Sicily and Sardinia.

[M Winther]

Post by Lance
Well they were not Vikings!
The book is careful and assesses all claims against the available
evidence. I haven't finished but it seems they came from Southern
Italy, Sicily and Sardinia.

It has been argued that it was the Philistines that attacked Egypt in
1190 B.C. But it is wrong then. It was the predecessors of the
Etruscans(?).

Mats

[Lance]

It is all complicated. More than half of Cline's book consists of notes and references. It seems that the sea people were probably not one group of people but several groups. They were refugees fleeing the effects of a very severe drought. The sea people who attacked Egypt (twice) were identified by Ramses III as coming from Italy, Sicily and Sardinia. But the sea people who destroyed Ugarit were either disaffected citizens of Ugarit (the King of Cyprus thought so) or low status refugees from Mycenaea (so possibly related to the Philistines). Cline doesn't think the Philistines were responsible for the destruction of cities in Canaan - the carbon dating of the many layers of ruined cities does not support that idea. Cline thinks the Philistines simply occupied cities that had already been destroyed or abandoned.

Generally Cline seems to think that the Bronze age ended not because of the sea peoples or any single cause but for multiple reasons. The drought (supported by pollen counts, studies of tree rings, and textual evidence from archaeology) seems to have lasted a very long time and resulted in famine (The king of the Hittites wrote begging Egypt for food). There were many earthquakes in a short period (50 to 100 years) with the same cities being repeatedly flattened and rebuilt according to archeological evidence (walls shifted, crushed skeletons, no evidence of fire or arrow heads, some walls repaired and rebuilt). However there is also evidence of wide spread rebellion (only government and high status parts of cities being burnt and destroyed). The sea peoples were probably the result of the drought and famine causing major population movements, but the people they attacked were already weakened and in some cases cities had already been abandoned. Cline seems to think that Mycenaea and perhaps some other countries had become overly dependent on imports (Mycenaea had to import tin, copper, glass, and the oils for their perfume industry, with tin having to come all the way from Afghanistan) so that the interruption of the trade network would have damaged these countries severely. Cline also thinks that the destruction of the Bronze age countries took longer than just facing sea borne invasions, he thinks it was a gradual process over a period of 50 to 100 years...

Lance